For the Love of Ministry (And Each Other)
Love is in the air, and so is the shared calling of ministry! As Valentine's Day approaches, we asked four ministry couples from across the Horizon Texas Conference to talk about what it's really like when both partners are serving in vocational ministry. From navigating busy church calendars to finding moments of rest, from supporting each other's callings to protecting family time, these couples offer a glimpse into the joys, challenges, and unexpected perks of doing ministry side by side. Whether they're serving at the same church or different congregations, one thing is clear: their love for each other and their love for the work God has called them to are beautifully intertwined.
H&J: Holly Brower (Director of Communications at FUMC Hurst) and Rev. Johnny Brower (Lead Pastor at FUMC Hurst)
B&J: Brock Johnson (Director of Traditional Worship and Facilities at Creekwood UMC in Allen) and Rev. Jenna Johnson (Senior Pastor at Wylie UMC)
L&M: Rev. Dr. Laulie Eckeberger (Associate Pastor at Holy Covenant UMC in Carrollton) and Rev. Monica Frazier (Associate Minister of Adult Discipleship & Congregational Care at FUMC Dallas)
C&K: Rev. Charles Robinson (Associate Pastor at Lovers Lane UMC in Dallas) and Rev. Kantrice Robinson (Senior Pastor at St. Paul UMC in Dallas)
Who's more of the last-minute problem solver, and who's more of the long-range planner?
Holly & Johnny: Honestly, we both do both. We each enjoy planning ahead, but we're also comfortable jumping in to solve problems when something unexpected pops up. We're very much an "all hands on deck" team that is always anticipating each other's needs, working well together, and adapting quickly when plans change.
Brock & Jenna: Neither. We have too many little kids to think about anything more than four minutes ahead. (But seriously, Jenna is the planner and Brock loves solving last-minute problems!)
Laulie & Monica: We work together really well and are good at creating plans and systems to make our lives function the best we can. We center each other and our relationship, self-care, and actually having a life outside of ministry. We carve out time for long-range planning whether it's finances, fun travel plans, or whatever, and when things pop up unexpectedly we try to make sure to text or touch base with each other to make decisions together. We make plans, think through things together, and work together in every way. Communication is key! It's really both of us.
Charles & Kantrice: Kantrice is more of the last-minute problem solver and we're both long-range planners.
Who's more likely to start a conversation with a stranger in the grocery store, and why?
H&J: Johnny, without question, is the social butterfly. He could make a new best friend in the cereal aisle in under 30 seconds. That said…Holly has her own version of this, because if we're in HEB, she will absolutely start conversations, not necessarily about life, but about how HEB might be one of God's greatest gifts to humanity. Holly will evangelize about HEB to anyone who will listen.
B&J: Whoever is with our eldest daughter, because she will talk to a brick wall. Then either of us is roped in! Jenna will generally only start a conversation with a mom to tell her she's awesome; otherwise she prefers to be invisible.
L&M: Monica, definitely. She can't help herself—especially if someone seems like they can't find what they're looking for! She's a classic two on the enneagram and is so warm, kind, and friendly to everyone she meets.
C&K: Charles is more likely to start a conversation with a stranger. Kantrice will need to ask her therapist to answer the "why".
What's something people assume about being a ministry couple that isn't actually true?
H&J: People may assume that because we are a ministry couple we're basically "on" (spiritually) all the time. As if our home is non-stop hymns, devos, and church services. The truth is, we are just a normal couple doing life together. We laugh a lot, we unwind, we are human… and yes, we occasionally say words that won't show up in Sunday's sermon. People also assume that we go home and debrief every conversation we have at church. But honestly, we take confidence and boundaries very seriously.
B&J: We only talk about church.
L&M: That we don't face the same joys and challenges of any other marriage. Our married life is a lot like any other couple's—we navigate the same household tasks, finding time for everything, deciding whose turn it is to cook dinner, navigating relationships with in-laws. Our whole lives don't revolve around church and theology. We think some people assume we have a self-righteous worldview or that we are holier, but we are normal people who are just trying to be the best versions of ourselves. We're just trying to be who God calls us to be, in our individual lives and ministry as well as a couple.
What's the most unexpected perk of both being in ministry?
H&J: How much easier it is to remember names and connections. Having someone at home who knows the same people and stories means we're constantly helping each other fill in the gaps, and it makes caring for people feel even more like a shared calling.
L&M: Both of us have the week between Christmas and New Year's off, which we relish as a chance to reset for the new year! And while it is kind of a bummer to never get to worship together, it is very cool to have two communities that care about us and are praying for us. People at Holy Covenant are always asking about Monica, her ministry, and how she is doing, and same for Laulie at First Dallas. We've also expanded our own circles by being a part of each other's circle. This has helped us feel a greater connection to both our ministry work and the Horizon Texas Conference.
C&K: Being about to have good theological conversations as well as dialogue around sermon content and creation with each other.
What's your go-to post-Sunday or post-event decompression routine?
H&J: Food and board games. In that order.
L&M: Sunday afternoons for us are about unplugging, telling each other the craziest moments of our Sunday, and then our start-of-the-week routine of meal prep and menu planning, household chores, etc. We try to rest and relax on Sunday afternoons to prep for the week. We're both what we would call extroverted introverts—we can be extroverted and "on" with our churches and our ministry, but then we need time to rest and recoup.
C&K: Eat and take a nap!
What's one way your spouse's calling has shaped your own faith?
B&J: Brock came to United Methodism as we were beginning our relationship, and so Jenna has watched him go through some pretty significant theological shifts since they've been together—well before he ever began to think about full-time church work as a vocation. This has helped Jenna see the world and her own faith through a different lens, giving her a great deal more patience and grace with people in the pews who are also slowly coming to a faith of unlimited grace. It's forced her to be doubly sure about what she believes, and to be clear about what is important for her personal faith. Watching Brock grow into a life of ministry has been a gift that Jenna didn't see coming, and a season she is incredibly grateful for. Brock is kind and generous, and it's been fun for Jenna to watch his church and congregation get to know and love him and see his gifts that she has seen and known for years. Brock credits much of that to Jenna's sermons. He doesn't get to hear every one of them because they serve in different churches, but when he does get to listen to them, he always walks away with inspiration.
L&M: Monica: Laulie's calling is distinct from mine and it has been incredible to watch the Spirit work through her and to witness her living into her calling as a pastor. I love that our residency journeys have overlapped. My faith is made stronger as I witness her resilience, reliance on God, and how she reminds me that God's grace is at work in every moment. She is an incredible pastor who cares for people deeply and fully and makes every room she enters come alive with light and love. God shines in her so clearly. In ministry, Laulie has taught me how to really trust my voice and experience as a pastor because of how intuitively she lives out her calling.
Laulie: Monica was made for this work. She fully and truly embodies the work of a pastor in the service and honor of God. She loves, includes, works for justice, and walks with people with her full self and with everything she has. She has since the day I met her, way before she considered ordained ministry in the United Methodist Church. Her commitment to her call no matter what has inspired me to answer my call and truthfully and honestly follow where God is leading me. She has overcome so many blocks and challenges and "nos" and "not yets" and has stayed strong and committed to who she knows God is calling her to be. I can only aspire to have the same resolve in my call.
C&K: Charles: Kantrice's calling has helped me to see the disparities that women face serving in ministry as opposed to male clergy. There are certain conversations that she must entertain that I would not even have to address, prove myself capable in, or debate. This has helped me understand that we have more justice/equity work to do not only in our broader communities but also within the UMC. Her witness to our daughters of what it means to be Black, female, educated, and called by God is a blessing that has shaped how my own personal theology aligns with God's desire and commitment to be in relationship with everyone regardless of station in society.
Kantrice: Witnessing Charles live out his calling has taught me to lead with greater grace and to hold ministry with open hands. The tenderness he shows our daughters—listening, praying, and making time for them even after long days—has given me a deeper glimpse of God's gentleness and faithfulness. Observing him show up with humility and devotion, even when tired or stretched thin, has strengthened my trust that God works through ordinary, imperfect people. His calling has shaped my faith into something more resilient and grace-filled, reminding me that God is present in our shared vulnerability, parenting, and our partnership.
What has been the hardest part of being in vocational ministry together?
H&J: This might be the most boring answer, but honestly… nothing. Being in ministry together hasn't made life harder. It's mostly just given us more perks, more shared stories, and more reasons to be grateful.
B&J: Since we serve at different churches, managing our calendar around church events is complicated. Who wants to babysit Easter morning so we can be at our churches at 6 a.m.?! Only Grandma, and we are eternally grateful for her when she is available.
L&M: These jobs are intense, and our busy times throughout the year are generally the same. There is a lot of time, energy, weekends, and nights required to do it, and sometimes that gets in the way of relationships or work-life balance. We have to be intentional about finding space and time for ourselves and one another. We anticipated this challenge and wanted to be proactive about it, so we asked Revs. Laura and Billy Echols Richter to be our clergy couple mentors. They gave us really good advice when we first met with them this past summer. They told us to make sure that our lives aren't always centered around Holy Covenant United Methodist Church, First United Methodist Church Dallas, the Metro East District, the Horizon Texas Conference, or the United Methodist Church. We have centered that advice as we begin this journey as pastors and as a clergy couple.
What would you want a church to understand most about supporting ministry couples well?
H&J: We've been incredibly fortunate—every church and ministry setting we've served has supported us so well, both as a family and as individuals. They've prayed for us, walked with us through difficult seasons, and honored each of our unique callings. The best support we've received is when a church understands and celebrates our different gifts, and how we each contribute to the same shared mission.
B&J: Supporting the two of us well often looks like supporting our kids and showing up for them! Most ministry couples just need to be seen like everyone else—to feel known and supported and loved is a gift that we all can be grateful for! Another way to support us would be to recognize that for us to have healthy boundaries, we need to have the space to NOT answer the phone or emails after hours. With both of us in couches, protecting our family time is so important. That doesn't mean we won't respond to emergencies and pastoral needs that are time sensitive, but it does mean we need to feel that we have the space not to need to pipe up about church wallpaper on a Tuesday evening or an event happening in six weeks on a Saturday morning.
C&K: Unless we are serving the same church, we more than likely will not be in Sunday worship together, and our children will pick and choose where they will go to church each week and how they will be involved in the ministry. Also, please understand that we are not competitors—do your best not to pit us against each other and do your best not to compare/contrast us to each other.